Where Are Our Heavenly Seats?

Recently, our brother, Pastor Sadler, who is the President of the Berean Bible Society, published an article called Who Returns with Christ at His Second Coming? He writes, “Scripture makes clear that angels also return with Christ (Matt. 25:31; 2 Thes. 1:7). However, members of the Church, the Body of Christ, are not of the number that return with Christ at His Second Coming. We will remain in heaven in the glorified bodies that we will have received at the Rapture (1 Cor. 15:51-54 cf. Eph. 2:6).”

My dear brother, what are you talking about? None of those verses you cited even remotely suggest that the Body of Christ will be spending all of eternity in Heaven.

Where is the verse that says WHEN we’re taking up our heavenly seats? That verse doesn’t exist. This means no one can state with certainty that we WILL or WILL NOT be taking up our heavenly seats at His Second Coming or any other time for that matter. Why? Because the Bible never addresses this. When I suggest on our podcasts that we may take up our seats at His Second Coming, I’m very upfront about the fact that I’m speculating. Yet, this BBS article states as some doctrinal fact that we’re all going to stay up in Heaven for all eternity when there is not one word in Paul’s epistles to support that idea.

So where are those heavenly places where we’re going to be seated? Is a heavenly place only in Heaven itself? Or does the Bible perhaps speak of more than one Heaven (2 Cor. 12:1-5)? If there is more than one Heaven, aren’t those ALL heavenly places?

And wouldn’t we all agree, as well, that Christ seated atop Mt. Zion during the kingdom is a Heavenly seat? How can it not be?

Heavenly Places

This phrase, heavenly places, is only found in Ephesians. In fact, Paul references heavenly places five times in this one epistle.

The first reference is in Eph. 1:3. Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ. People and beings in heavenly places are spiritually blessed. We have all the same spiritual blessings that everyone else has IN heavenly places, which are internal spiritual enrichments.

The second reference is Eph 1:20. Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places. Christ occupies heavenly places now and wouldn’t His throne atop Zion also be a heavenly place?

The third reference is in Eph 2:6. And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus. We aren’t simply dead, buried, and risen with Christ. We’re also exalted with Christ to occupy seats of authority with Him over the entire Kingdom of God and those seats exist in heavenly places. Christ isn’t going to have an UN-heavenly seat when He rules over His kingdom here on Earth.

The fourth reference is in Eph 3:10. To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God. Both the heavenly angels and the demonic realm who now occupy positions of authority in heavenly places above the Earth are being exposed to the genius wisdom of God through the church and all of us saints living these lives of grace because of the gospel.

[This isn’t one of the references, but I’d say special mention should be given to Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens (that is to say, all heavenly places), that he might fill all things. Christ occupies a heavenly place that is far above all the other heavenly places. His position over the heavenly places demonstrates His authority and His right to fill all those heavenly places with all of us, which may or may not take place at His Second Coming, although some brethren predict this may happen at the midway point of the Tribulation, and that is fine. We’ll find out when it happens.]

And finally, the fifth reference is Eph 6:12. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places (in heavenly places). This verse reveals to us that in the spiritual realm, there is a demonic hierarchy of positions of authority. Paul starts by listing the lower positions and works his way up the chain: principalities, then powers, then rulers of the darkness of this world, and then spiritual wickedness in high places (which means – in heavenly places).

I’d suggest that these positions are largely geographical also. You might remember the story in Daniel 10 when Daniel was given a vision. He prays and asks for an interpretation. God sends an angel. But he’s held up for 21 days. He’s withstood by the prince of the kingdom of Persia, the demon who was over the kingdom of Persia. God had to send Michael, the archangel, to deal with him so the angel could fly down to Daniel to explain the vision. This story illustrates among things that Satan has an organizational structure over the nations and continents. And I’ll bet Satan still has a similar type of structure as he had in the OT in which the demons have varying levels of authority over regions and nations of the earth. The higher the position over the Earth, the higher the authority.

Third Heaven

Do we not all agree that there are three heavens? Remember how Paul said he was caught up to the “third heaven” in 2 Cor. 12:1-5? There are three heavens. The third Heaven is Heaven itself, the abode of God, is it not? That’s where Paul was caught up to. The second Heaven would be the universe. And the first Heaven has to be the Earth’s atmosphere. Everything above ground would technically be part of the first Heaven.

All three Heavens are heavenly places, are they not? Why would they be called a first, second, or third Heaven if they weren’t heavenly places?

Question: Isn’t the position occupied by the prince of the kingdom of Persia a heavenly place that Paul referenced in Eph. 6:12? Isn’t this one of the invisible thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers in the upper atmosphere of the Earth? Are those not heavenly seats?

Is not Christ seated atop Mt. Zion throughout His millennial reign also heavenly seat? How can Christ have anything less than a heavenly seat in the kingdom?

I would suggest that our heavenly seats just might occupy all three Heavens, or heavenly realms, although there may not be a second heaven in the kingdom because during the Tribulation, the second heaven will be rolled up as a scroll (Rev. 6:14).

So the positions held by demons in the spiritual realm is what Paul’s referencing as principalities, then powers, then rulers of the darkness of this world, and then spiritual wickedness in high places in Eph. 6:12. He also says in Eph. 4:10 that the Lord has ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things. The Lord ascended above heavenly places so He can fill those positions in the heavenly places with – what?

All of us.

Paul makes these same points in Col. 1:16. He references thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers. Then he says in Col. 1:20 that God is going to reconcile all things unto himself. God is going to fill those positions with members of the Body of Christ.

Those are our heavenly seats in heavenly places.

What else could Paul mean in Col. 1:20?

Paul also says in 1 Thess. 4:17 – “and so shall we ever be with the Lord.” Where’s the Lord going to be during the kingdom? He’s going to be on Earth, is He not?

Paul tells us in Eph. 2:6 that God made US sit together in heavenly places. That is the Body of Christ all seated together, working together, in the heavenly realms probably above Earth in the atmosphere, perhaps even extending all the way up into the third Heaven. the phrase, “heavenly places” represents the sphere of the Lord’s dwelling and authority.

Those heavenly places are in Christ. Just as all the spiritual blessings we have is because we’re in Christ, so too, our seats and our positions for all eternity are also in Christ. Everything we are now and everything we will be and the positions we will have – it’s all in Christ. So the heavenly places in Christ are Christ’s places in the heavens. Those are His places, His governmental positions, over the Earth. Those heavenly places embody the entire realm of Christ’s heavenly government.

How can those positions not include the ones now occupied by the demonic realm?

Consider 1 Cor. 6:1 – Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 1Co 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

I think one of the most telling things about these passages is in vs. 2. Paul makes a comparison between us being able to properly judge conflicts and issues in this life with us judging the world in the life to come. He says in vs. 2 if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? When he says smallest matters, he’s talking about all the petty drama and lawsuits going on at Corinth. They were to Paul the most trivial disputes. Paul is using some hyperbole here to emphasize how insignificant their little drama was in comparison to the majestic, heavenly roles awaiting them.

So he makes a comparison here between them judging conflicts NOW versus them judging the world LATER. There is a connection between judgments now and judgments later. Both judgments are about conflicts, evaluating them, being able to discern a right course of action, and making the right decision.

I’d suggest that in the future, we’re going to evaluate problems and sin in the kingdom. When Paul says the world will be judged by you, this is more than just having a position of authority and you’re sort of overseeing what’s happening and that is the extent of how you’ll govern. That’s not it at all. There is a connection here. Your wisdom applied to conflicts in this life has a parallel to your future roles judging the world. You will be seeing things taking place in the world. You will be evaluating them, and making decisions that reflect the Lord’s righteousness.

I think Paul is only talking here about our roles in the thousand year-reign. There will be sin in the kingdom. You remember after His Second Coming, the OT saints will be resurrected in their sinless, glorified bodies. They’re judged by the Lord and given their positions in the kingdom. Then the Lord will judge the sheep and the goat nations. The goats are all the unbelieving Gentiles. The sheep are all the believing Gentiles who survived the Tribulation. The goats are cast into the Lake of Fire. The sheep are miraculously healed and allowed into the kingdom in their sin-corrupted bodies, but they’ve been given long life, like Adam.

And they will enter the kingdom. They will establish their own Gentile nations. And they will have children. Those children will, many of them, grow up and refuse to accept by faith that Christ is the Son of God. After the thousand years, Satan will be loosed. Those unbelieving offspring will align themselves with Satan. They’ll take up arms against Christ. They’ll surround the Promised Land. The Lord will plead with them to change their minds. Then He’ll speak to Satan one last time. He’s going to say, “Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years that I would bring thee against them?” (Eze 38:17) Which is just so utterly brilliant. He’s basically saying, “Did I not foretell in prophecy a few thousand years ago that you would do this, and I would allow this to happen, and I would carry out this very judgment upon you?” Those will be the Lord’s final words to Satan.

Then – POOF. They’re all burned to a fair thee well.

What follows is the Great White Throne Judgment.

The point is, there will be sinless resurrected OT saints in the kingdom, and there will also be sin-corrupted Gentiles with long life giving birth to children who will grow up and refuse to believe and they will misbehave. There is going to be sin in the kingdom. There is a mountain of verses about how sin will be dealt with in the kingdom. Christ and His government will deal swiftly with any outbreak of sin should that occur (Ps. 2:9; 72:1-4; Isa. 29:20-21; 65:20; 66:24; Zech. 14:16-21; Jer. 31:29-30). “He shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked” (Isa. 11:4).

I think us saints in our heavenly seats judging the world means that we will be part of that process of dealing with sin in the kingdom.

One of my favorite stories about sin in the kingdom is Zech. 14:16-18 talking about how if a nation refuses to comply with God’s laws like worshipping Him or observing the Feast of Tabernacles, the Lord will just deny those nations rain or He’ll send plagues. “Oh, you don’t want to worship the Lord? No problem. Your country won’t be getting any rain for a very long time. Good luck with that!” I love that. I suspect we will be part of that process.

Some might think, “Well, that doesn’t sound like a lot of fun.”

You have no idea how much fun that will be.

You’ll have a completely different mindset when you’re sinless and perfectly righteous in all of your thinking. You will love applying the rightness of His ways to these issues in the kingdom. You having a role of authority in the kingdom, the Lord is sharing with you His joy in reigning over the kingdom (Matt. 25:21,23). There is a mutual feeling of joy in the act of reigning over the Lord’s kingdom. The same will be true for us.